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call for volunteers
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Post new topic   Reply to topic    RUGGED DEFENSE, http://the-strategist.net/RD Forum Index -> Rugged Defense site design and use
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Planetep



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 179
Location: France

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 1:25 pm    Post subject: call for volunteers Reply with quote

Dear Rugged-defense members,


We have been managing the site for about three years, bringing some
novelties while
assuring games recording. We also set up a successful scenario depot.

Now we would like to pass on to someone else that volunteers to
continue making rugged-defense live.
Otherwise we plan to close the site at the end of the year.

there are a couples of php scripts that make all the job of game
recording and site generation, so that even a non specialist can
drive the site.


Lucinus and Planetep
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piero1971



Joined: 02 Aug 2003
Posts: 51
Location: Geneva

PostPosted: Sat Oct 15, 2005 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

if only I could do it!

someone should update this site (Matrix to buy it?) as it is the best scenario archive!
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Stauffenberg



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 3:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Salut,

I've been talking to Francois and Pascal in the hope that we can work something out. I have every confidence that the superb scenario archive--the best format and utility for TOAW scenarios on the net--will not be allowed to disappear at the very least.

We may try some ideas to get this forum going as well.

Daniel (Stauffenberg)
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macnab



Joined: 18 Feb 2003
Posts: 8
Location: uk

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sorry to hear the info , thanks for what you have done,. hope it continues, not much i can do except offer support,
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Wilhelm



Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 76
Location: New Jersey, USA

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 12:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Why are you shutting down? Is it time or money?
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Legun



Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 28
Location: Cracow, Poland

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ah, Bad news! The whole system of the ladder is the best available. Unfortunately, there is a game just starting in Poland - the game for new election law. I'm overwise engaged in the game so it isn't good time to learn new skills. I could pay some money to keep the site working. I'll ask the TDG staff if it could be possible to keep the ladder working with their support, too.
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Planetep



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 179
Location: France

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

we are demotivated, but if we can create a new spirit and for instance share the cost (time and money) of the site with some of you interested, thats another thing.

but well anyway I thank you for your reactions !

If the site would be to continue, I think we should rethink what is to be removed and what is to be kept, I think the stats should be more scenario centric, and also that the scoring system for players should be modified.
very static and regularly raising ladders have become boring.

Tournaments should be the backbone of players scoring, and free games only giving marginal points to players but would be important for scenario statistics. We should always have tournaments running.

free games could be like training for players (with some marginal points) and informative for scenario balance, and tournaments give points for ranking players. just like in golf or tennis you get an index through competitions, if I can make such comparison...



just some ideas
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Legun



Joined: 09 Feb 2003
Posts: 28
Location: Cracow, Poland

PostPosted: Sun Oct 16, 2005 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is a good time for TOAW community. The possibity of game development could brings a new spirit. It's observed on WHQ and TDG discussion boards. You could wait a moment. Anyway - a discussion about the ladder itself is interesting, too. I would like to see different sub-ladders for monster-lovers and others, f.e.
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zazar



Joined: 05 Feb 2003
Posts: 3

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I seriously do hope someone will be able to keep this up ! Unfortunatly I really do not have the time to do it . Please keep us informed .

And thanks for everything .
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"zazar"
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Lucinus



Joined: 24 Jan 2003
Posts: 311
Location: France

PostPosted: Mon Oct 17, 2005 6:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What we need the most is some good willing to participate to the forum, making AAR, making graphics etc ... no need to be a senior programmer or the best player of the toaw's planet. In short to add values to this site and not just be passive "consumers".
If everyone is staying passive, this site will die for sure because Pascal and me cannot do everything. Like everyone else we have a reduce free time.

Yes, we may have made a good "technical" site but without a spirit this is useless.

If everyone can give just a very small amount of time, everything go become more attracting.
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Wilhelm



Joined: 26 Jan 2003
Posts: 76
Location: New Jersey, USA

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 1:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

A short history - as best I can give it.

The RD TOAW site was created by Lars back in 1998. Seven years ago. At that time all we had was TOAW Vol I. About a year later a companion site, TOAW II devoted to TOAW II (of course) was set up by Fabrizio.

After TOAW WotY and TOAW COW came out it was decided to merge the two ladders into one ladder which handled all versions of TOAW. After Lars daughter was born he found he just did not have the time to run things. I guess that was around 2000.

So a group of four, myself, Schnelle Heinz, Fabrizio and Manowar ran the ladder for a few years. We did it all by hand. No automation. So when Lucinus and Plantep took over and automated everything we were happy as pigs to see things.

My point is that RD is the longest and oldest TOAW ladder. I would truly hate to see it go away. I don’t know what I would do with my nights Laughing

I have read what has been written about tournaments. Having run one in ’99, ’00, ’01 and ’03 I can tell you all they are the worst headaches I have ever had. Players sign up, disappear, don’t do turns on schedule, don’t follow instructions, don’t submit result reports, and are generally PITAs. I ended the 2003 tournament because I was so fed up with the lack of co-operation from the entrants. I would be happy to see a tournament – but I have run four (not to mention the two “Battle of the Ladders” tournament in ’00 and ’01) – which had the same problems.

I have very limited internet technical knowledge. I don’t even know what php is that Lucinus mention in his messages. (Shame on me)

I’d volunteer if I had any idea of what needed to be done. I don't.

I just know that I don’t want to see RD TOAW die.

Any hope of TDG taking over running the site? I would not like to see us merged and loose our identity.

Again I ask, what can be done to avoid this?
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belisarius



Joined: 16 Feb 2003
Posts: 32
Location: Montreal, Canada

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 3:05 am    Post subject: Lucinus and Planetep retiring Reply with quote

Messieurs

I would be willing to dedicate a few hours a week in terms of keeping the site alive. I've been a member since the early days (1999 I should say) and cannot stand by and watch this great site go down !

I've a bit of technical knowledge, nothing like yours but can do the basics - ftp, a VERY limited amount of html ... all I know re: php is that it's a powerful open source scripting language ... if you're willing to guide me I could probably keep things hobbling along. Pascal you and i had quite a run of great matches back a few years ago, you know who i am Wink

let me know

regards

Belisarius
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Stauffenberg



Joined: 09 Nov 2003
Posts: 25

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would like to see the site continue as independent if at all possible. Its hard enough to get things going with TOAW but we have all hung in with it over the years and now, surely, with Matrix backing a new release--now is not the time to pack it in.

I think we should work out some way of funding the site. It might even be feasible for Matrix to fund it as the more independent sites "talking about TOAW" and generally promoting it, the better for Matrix. It could be listed on Matrix TOAW publications as the ideal "official" TOAW online scenario archive perhaps, although I in no way would want to ignore Andy Eaton's fine TOAW site. Perhaps Andy could merge his archive with yours? I note he is hard up for funding too....

As far as getting the site more active, this will take time but I'll give you my view on what might be the best course. I see no point in attempting to compete with the Strategy Zone to get gamers to just hang-out and "chat" here, at least not until after a successful Matrix release of TOAW and an infusion of alot of new players. TDG is pursuing their own scenario design agenda which is fine, others like myself prefer to work independently, but the point is that there is not a good reason to try and make this a scenario design forum per se, at least not right now.

What RD has is a superb scenario archive and publication of scenario and ladder stats--very clean feel, very useful. I'm running the Matrix Scenario Selection Group (comprised of 20 designers and players) and I've put forward the plan to use the scenario archive at Rugged Defense as the most useful starting point from which to go through all the TOAW scenarios available. As such, we would see Rugged Defense acknowledged in the scenario production notes which can't hurt in terms of publicity.

It seems to me that there is one really tangible area of TOAW that has not yet been nailed down by any site in a comprehensive way: After Action Reports. Players (& designers) love reading these, and once you get the ball rolling on that you will find people regularly popping by to check out the latest AARs. This will not happen overnight but the sooner we start on that, the sooner it will begin developing.

So I'll make two commitments here:

1) I'll approach Matrix on this if Francois and Pascal agree to it.

2) I'll move all my ongoing AARs here as soon as I can. I'll run the AAR section if that seems best (I wouold rather someone else actually) and will actively solicit AARs from other designers (like Piero for example). Other people can solicit with gamers as I am not involved with ladder play myself.

My two cents.

Daniel
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Planetep



Joined: 23 Jan 2003
Posts: 179
Location: France

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 6:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

for information, the hosting (www.infomaniak.ch) of the site costs 120 euros a year, cost currently shared between Lucinus and me.

it's not terribly expensive but if it is possible to share with more people, taking a share or just a small contribution that would be better.

someone taking a share must be someone we "know" if only virtually Wink, and could incidentally access the ressources offered by the hosting (personal space for ftp, email address, etc..).

we can also imagine a paypal button for voluntary contribution, with a record of sum and nickname of the generous funder.
but the idea is not to make money on the site, just cover the cost of the hosting.
we don't want neither to add any banners of course.

as Wilhelm pointed out this is the oldest toaw ladder and we have an originality and a history. here is how I see it.

we don't necessarily want over active strategy zone -like chat forums, but a place with scenarios, players, aar, some fine history, old pictures,
designers notes, some strategy guides etc..

Stauffenberg settling here and the presence of designers go in the right direction and would add much value to the site.

I'm not against a matrix contribution if it is understood as a sort of patronage and does not involve any contract.

For the rest, it's true that it's hard to manage tournaments, and that players are not all regular.
So I think the general idea is mostly for now conserve the site and stat as it is, but enrich the content to give a feeling of life back in the site.

Personally I have less time that I had when I developped the stats two years ago. But I like to undo and redo so I may strike again in the future. I'm interested in refining the stat system as shortly explained in the post above, but there is no hurry, this is anyway just for fun as the important think is a place with good scens good players as we have and playing resources.
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Ben Turner



Joined: 30 Mar 2003
Posts: 4
Location: London

PostPosted: Tue Oct 18, 2005 10:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wilhelm wrote:
Any hope of TDG taking over running the site? I would not like to see us merged and loose our identity.


If this were to happen (though everyone seems too busy to do something like this at the moment), I would expect RD to remain pretty distinct. The two sites have very different- but complimentary- philosophies, and they would be better run in parallel than as one entity.
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